Useless b****y doctors!

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Useless b****y doctors!

Postby carolad » Mon Aug 11, 2014 2:35 pm

Having been persuaded by a number of friends and your good selves, I phoned my GP this morning to see about getting my vitamin B12 levels checked. He was perfectly pleasant when I spoke to him (as he always is) and when I told him I had been a vegetarian for about 20 years and don't eat a lot of dairy products, which means I may be more prone to B12 deficiency, he agreed and said it would be a good idea to get it checked.

So I will get a blood test to get it checked...that is good. But why oh why oh why do I have to ask for everything myself? If he 'thought it was a good idea', why didn't he suggest it himself to start with? Absolutely everything I have got from my GP is because I have researched it myself and suggested it to him. Is he not supposed to be the one with the medical knowledge...is he not supposed to suggest things to me, instead of the other way round?

It is little wonder I have so little respect for the medical profession - in my experience, they have been as much use as a chocolate teapot ;)

Rant over :P :) x
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby keaedmondson » Mon Aug 11, 2014 3:56 pm

What is that phrase… Jack of all trades master of none??? I find the same thing. Going to the GP tomorrow and have a huge list of things I am going to say and I will be expecting done… Hope I don't get any contradictions! It is very exhausting though having to look up your own medications and read all the various articles about what tests you should ask for… ironic when we have a chronic pain and fatigue! Condition… I wish I got paid 100 grand or whatever it is! ;)
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby Lindilou » Mon Aug 11, 2014 7:02 pm

Beacuse it means more work for him now that you have thought of it. If you hadn't he wouldn't of been bothered to - naturaly. :roll: :crazy:
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby JYB » Sat Aug 16, 2014 3:18 pm

Now come on!! A GP has hundreds, sometimes thousands of patients to look after and you want him/her to think about each individual patient and do just exactly what you think should be done?
Patients should take responsibility for their own health and that is exactly what you have done, well done. Treat your GP as a partner when discussing your health, you can then work together with the same aim!
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby rich44 » Sat Aug 16, 2014 5:28 pm

Yes I do expect EXACTLY that. When I am talking to him it's about me and no one else and he should be telling me what the plan is not me saying I would like...

I saw a Dr recently and said I need painkillers to replace the tramadol and he said what do you want?

Well I don't know, I could've suggested tapentadol or Butrans or fentonyl or oramorph or high dose of dihydrocodeine or Lord knows what else but I don't know what's suitable and what's a sledgehammer.

I don't expect my gp to think of me when I'm not in the room/phone well unless he's promised to look into options
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby carolad » Sat Aug 16, 2014 8:38 pm

JYB wrote:Now come on!! A GP has hundreds, sometimes thousands of patients to look after and you want him/her to think about each individual patient and do just exactly what you think should be done?
Patients should take responsibility for their own health and that is exactly what you have done, well done. Treat your GP as a partner when discussing your health, you can then work together with the same aim!


Absolutely I want him to think about each individual patient - that is his job :roll: He is supposed to be the 'expert' here.

Are you really saying all patients should read medical journals, do research into various conditions, diagnose themselves and then decide what treatment they need? I think in reality, this is what happens a lot..but that doesn't make it right. What is the point of having GPs at all if you have to do everything for them? When you go and see a professional person, you expect them to advise you on their area of expertise. Would you go and see a solicitor and expect to do all your own research about the law beforehand? I don't think so.

I'm all on for taking responsibility for your own health but a GP should be proactive and give advice, not just do nothing because it is the easy option.
Last edited by carolad on Sat Aug 16, 2014 8:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby carolad » Sat Aug 16, 2014 8:42 pm

rich44 wrote:Yes I do expect EXACTLY that. When I am talking to him it's about me and no one else and he should be telling me what the plan is not me saying I would like...

I saw a Dr recently and said I need painkillers to replace the tramadol and he said what do you want?

Well I don't know, I could've suggested tapentadol or Butrans or fentonyl or oramorph or high dose of dihydrocodeine or Lord knows what else but I don't know what's suitable and what's a sledgehammer.

I don't expect my gp to think of me when I'm not in the room/phone well unless he's promised to look into options


Exactly! GPs have supposedly had medical training...supposedly they should know about various conditions and treatments. And if they don't know, they should read some medical journals to educate themselves :)
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby Lindilou » Sat Aug 16, 2014 9:31 pm

carolad wrote:
rich44 wrote:Yes I do expect EXACTLY that. When I am talking to him it's about me and no one else and he should be telling me what the plan is not me saying I would like...

I saw a Dr recently and said I need painkillers to replace the tramadol and he said what do you want?

Well I don't know, I could've suggested tapentadol or Butrans or fentonyl or oramorph or high dose of dihydrocodeine or Lord knows what else but I don't know what's suitable and what's a sledgehammer.

I don't expect my gp to think of me when I'm not in the room/phone well unless he's promised to look into options


Exactly! GPs have supposedly had medical training...supposedly they should know about various conditions and treatments. And if they don't know, they should read some medical journals to educate themselves :)


I'll second this too, it's their job. When you are sat there after finally getting an appointment then they should be thinking about each and every option !
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby lemurin » Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:33 am

I think it requires a bit of both sides to be honest.

I get what JYB is saying, because there are soooo many different medical conditions out there, it would be impossible for someone to know about all of them. Having said that, they should be eager to help and to find out what is wrong by suggesting tests and inquiring through other doctors. Sometimes they do need a little nudge by a patient and I am sure most are genuinely grateful that this happens. I have seen some doctors before using google to have a look at what symptoms are.
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby carolad » Tue Nov 11, 2014 11:03 pm

lemurin wrote:I think it requires a bit of both sides to be honest.

I get what JYB is saying, because there are soooo many different medical conditions out there, it would be impossible for someone to know about all of them. Having said that, they should be eager to help and to find out what is wrong by suggesting tests and inquiring through other doctors. Sometimes they do need a little nudge by a patient and I am sure most are genuinely grateful that this happens. I have seen some doctors before using google to have a look at what symptoms are.


I think in my case though, it has ben more than 'a little nudge' :) My GP has offered me nothing (apart from drugs!). I have had to ask for everything....and that is really not in my nature, so I find it difficult. I think a GP should be proactive and try to do the best for their patient. My experience has been that my GP is passive and it is always me having to go and do my homework and then ask him for things, based on what I have found out! He is a nice man too so I don't have anything against him personally. I just think it is the system...maybe it is down to money, that they don't want to pay for tests or treatment so they don't offer it unless someone specifically asks for it. That is wrong though :( And it worries me that a vulnerable person would not get any help at all. At least I am lucky enough to be relatively well educated so I can look into these things myself and challenge my GP... But that has been it, all along. When I first when to him with symptoms of fatigue, pain (other than my 'normal' scoliosis related back pain) and headaches, he just told me I was too thin and needed to eat more :roll: Should he not have sent me for a B12 test at that stage (amongst other things!)??

Anyway, I've given up on the NHS now, doctors can't do anything to help. I am doing everything I can to help myself and using alternative therapies, rather than conventional medicine. And I will be avoiding my GP as much as possible....going to see him is bad for my blood pressure because I get so annoyed at the system! :lol:
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby Queenie_70 » Wed Nov 12, 2014 9:07 am

Hi Carolad,

I can relate so closely to what you are describing. My daughter who passed away, was ill from birth. I lived in America (Alaska) at the time and I kept telling the doctors something wasn't right, that she was not as active as my other children. At 5 weeks old she was in intensive care for a respiratory infection that the doctor at the emergence room the night before said was croup and sent me home to give her steam treatment. His diagnosis was so wrong that I was killing her by adding liquid to her already filled lungs!!! It was then I was on a crusade to be her voice, be her soldier, and be pro-active.

Every time I saw a doctor for her I ordered her medical records to be sent to my home so I could go over them. Every appointment with her neurologist, I quizzed her about disorders I had researched and treatments that I had looked into. In her final days, it was me that called her doctor and ordered her to be put on morphine, knowing that doing so would be the last act of kindness I could provide. She had pneumonia, and we knew she would never recover, so the morphine allowed her to not struggle the last few days of her life.

Since I was diagnosed with fibro, I have gone from working 60 hours a week while taking night classes for my masters, to being stuck in bed on more days then I care to think about. I have been put in a coma by one doctor by giving me the wrong medication, and I realized then, I needed to be my own soldier and advocate because apparently no-one else was going to fight for me. The doctors I have had, come in a mixed bag of, remembering who I am and what I need to discuss, to blank stares and ignorance. I have moved 208 miles to try and get better treatment, but that too may have backfired. On top of this, I am my eldest daughters advocate for her mental illness and it seems that she is taking more care of me at the moment.

My goal today is to draft a letter to the Health Minister. I think it is time to take it to the top. Doctors, on the whole, do have the best intentions, and you at least have one who will agree to test you or consider what it is you have found out, but Fibro is still a condition that is ignored, and not treated the way it should be, as a whole person disease. To throw pills at the pain to shut us up is not treatment. We are living, breathing, real members of our communities, who just want, if not answers, at least to be taken seriously, to be listened to, and to be respected.

I often wonder if one healthy Minister was struck down with this, then how quickly things would change, but right now, we have to take each battle as it comes. I am sorry that you, along with us all, have this condition. I am sorry that with the little energy you have, it is spent wasted on figuring out what could help rather than spent with your family, and I am sorry that we all have to do this, when a good day maybe weeks away.

Sorry about the rant, but I get so hot under the collar, but more and more exhausted from fighting. I know though, I have to keep it up as the GP won't. Sad, but true.

Gentle hugs to all...xxx
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby carolad » Wed Nov 12, 2014 10:48 pm

Queenie_70 wrote:Hi Carolad,

I can relate so closely to what you are describing. My daughter who passed away, was ill from birth. I lived in America (Alaska) at the time and I kept telling the doctors something wasn't right, that she was not as active as my other children. At 5 weeks old she was in intensive care for a respiratory infection that the doctor at the emergence room the night before said was croup and sent me home to give her steam treatment. His diagnosis was so wrong that I was killing her by adding liquid to her already filled lungs!!! It was then I was on a crusade to be her voice, be her soldier, and be pro-active.

Every time I saw a doctor for her I ordered her medical records to be sent to my home so I could go over them. Every appointment with her neurologist, I quizzed her about disorders I had researched and treatments that I had looked into. In her final days, it was me that called her doctor and ordered her to be put on morphine, knowing that doing so would be the last act of kindness I could provide. She had pneumonia, and we knew she would never recover, so the morphine allowed her to not struggle the last few days of her life.

Since I was diagnosed with fibro, I have gone from working 60 hours a week while taking night classes for my masters, to being stuck in bed on more days then I care to think about. I have been put in a coma by one doctor by giving me the wrong medication, and I realized then, I needed to be my own soldier and advocate because apparently no-one else was going to fight for me. The doctors I have had, come in a mixed bag of, remembering who I am and what I need to discuss, to blank stares and ignorance. I have moved 208 miles to try and get better treatment, but that too may have backfired. On top of this, I am my eldest daughters advocate for her mental illness and it seems that she is taking more care of me at the moment.

My goal today is to draft a letter to the Health Minister. I think it is time to take it to the top. Doctors, on the whole, do have the best intentions, and you at least have one who will agree to test you or consider what it is you have found out, but Fibro is still a condition that is ignored, and not treated the way it should be, as a whole person disease. To throw pills at the pain to shut us up is not treatment. We are living, breathing, real members of our communities, who just want, if not answers, at least to be taken seriously, to be listened to, and to be respected.

I often wonder if one healthy Minister was struck down with this, then how quickly things would change, but right now, we have to take each battle as it comes. I am sorry that you, along with us all, have this condition. I am sorry that with the little energy you have, it is spent wasted on figuring out what could help rather than spent with your family, and I am sorry that we all have to do this, when a good day maybe weeks away.

Sorry about the rant, but I get so hot under the collar, but more and more exhausted from fighting. I know though, I have to keep it up as the GP won't. Sad, but true.

Gentle hugs to all...xxx


Oh Queenie, how awful for you, what a terrible experience you had with your poor daughter. I can't imagine how you would get over that xx

I think you put your finger on the problem with the NHS - 'not treated the way it should be, as a whole person disease'. Conventional western medicine tends to focus on the symptoms and they look at one thing at time - in general I mean, not specifically related to fibromyalgia. So they might try and treat (or more likely mask) your symptoms, but they don't look at the cause of the symptoms, or look at how they might be related to each other. Even when I went to an NHS physio years ago with lower back pain...they used to keep trying to correct my pelvis (it is twisted)...but they didn't take into account I had scoliosis and that was pulling my pelvis out of alignment. So they wasted their time trying to deal with one thing, without looking at my whole body.

Particularly with a complex mind/body condition like fibromyalgia, it is important to treat the person as a whole. You need to look at your lifestyle, your diet, your stress levels etc and recognise that the mental/emotional side of your life is connected to your physical health. I am interested in alternative medicine for this reason. Most alternative therapies will be more holistic in nature and they will look at the balance of your body, rather than just concentrate on one or two symptoms.

My current private physio is amazing. She does take a holistic approach - my main area of pain is usually my lower back/sacroiliac joints but she will assess my body as a whole and will sometimes treat my neck or thoracic spine because that is where the main problem is - she knows how everything is connected and she doesn't just treat the sore bits, like the NHS physios did. She also uses chinese medicine, along with more conventional physio techniques. And I find this fascinating because when she assesses my body, she will often tell me about my emotional state, based on what she has found. So for example, she will say my liver energy is blocked and this signifies frustration or anger in my life...and you know what, she is right :shock: Every time! I have no idea how she does it, but it just proves to me that my emotional health will affect my physical health. I think this is why CBT is often used for people with chronic pain conditions, because it will help with the emotional side of things.

Anyway, that was just a long-winded way to say I've given up on the NHS for treatment and am going for a more holistic approach. I will still continue to take the drugs though - I am grateful to the NHS for that ;)
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby Queenie_70 » Thu Nov 13, 2014 8:27 am

Hi Carolad,

I too am looking into holistic versions of treatment. Indian head massage is something I used to treat myself to years ago, but now I am thinking of restarting it for the headaches and migraines. If I can relieve some of the tension, then maybe the headaches won't be quite as bad. I do find that a long hot bath is an amazing relaxant. When I have the time/energy/motivation to have one, I fill it to the brim and get in like bugs bunny does a cauldron....very carefully. Occasionally I will allow myself a glass of wine while I lay there up to my chin in bubbles and warmth. The only down side is I do find I get really itchy afterwards because all the pores are now open.

My youngest, Miranda, was and is an angel. I never thought I would be able to do what I did for her, but she made i easy by just being so amazing. I spent night after night on the internet gathering information to discuss with anyone of her doctors, (at the end of her life she was being treated by 30 different specialists). That experience should have made me realize when I was getting ill that it was time to hop back on the research wagon, but I had hoped it wouldn't be necessary.

Part of the problem is, a GP has 10 minutes to get you in the room, listen to what you have to say, scan their memory to see if they have come across or know what is going on, ergo make a diagnosis, decide on treatment, discuss this with you (and hope that you agree), and then write up your notes. It takes me almost that long just to walk to the door of his office!!!

I like to think of us, and I do mean all of us, as a miniature army, marching along and fighting for all who do not have a voice. Maybe one day we will win this battle :)

xxx
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Re: Useless b****y doctors!

Postby carolad » Thu Nov 13, 2014 2:05 pm

Queenie_70 wrote:Hi Carolad,

I too am looking into holistic versions of treatment. Indian head massage is something I used to treat myself to years ago, but now I am thinking of restarting it for the headaches and migraines. If I can relieve some of the tension, then maybe the headaches won't be quite as bad. I do find that a long hot bath is an amazing relaxant. When I have the time/energy/motivation to have one, I fill it to the brim and get in like bugs bunny does a cauldron....very carefully. Occasionally I will allow myself a glass of wine while I lay there up to my chin in bubbles and warmth. The only down side is I do find I get really itchy afterwards because all the pores are now open.

My youngest, Miranda, was and is an angel. I never thought I would be able to do what I did for her, but she made i easy by just being so amazing. I spent night after night on the internet gathering information to discuss with anyone of her doctors, (at the end of her life she was being treated by 30 different specialists). That experience should have made me realize when I was getting ill that it was time to hop back on the research wagon, but I had hoped it wouldn't be necessary.

Part of the problem is, a GP has 10 minutes to get you in the room, listen to what you have to say, scan their memory to see if they have come across or know what is going on, ergo make a diagnosis, decide on treatment, discuss this with you (and hope that you agree), and then write up your notes. It takes me almost that long just to walk to the door of his office!!!

I like to think of us, and I do mean all of us, as a miniature army, marching along and fighting for all who do not have a voice. Maybe one day we will win this battle :)

xxx


Miranda sounds like she was a very special little girl xx

You are right about the length of time with the GP - I complain about doctors but I think it is the system to blame, rather than the individual. I'm sure my GP's reluctance to offer me tests or treatments is down to not having the money to spend on such things. Unfortunately though, this means that the pushy people get somewhere but people who don't like to make a fuss get ignored...

You sound like a lovely person, with a positive attitude. I hope the Indian head massage helps you :) xx
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