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The UKFibromyalgia Forums • View topic - the magical plant



the magical plant

Any tips on what helps you including alternative medicine.

Moderators: perseus, *Lisa*, FluppyPuffy

Re: the magical plant

Postby hamstergirl » Wed Mar 24, 2010 8:58 pm

Hi

That was what i was trying to say in my first post. While its up to you what you put in your body, its your family and friends who do all the worrying and suffering. I know that by personal experience and is probably why i HATE putting any drug in my body.

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Re: the magical plant

Postby velvet » Wed Mar 24, 2010 9:00 pm

gill i accept not recommending it and strongly warning of the dangers however i think we should be able to discuss its use and more importantly the denial of the medical form which as min pointed out earlier give the pain relief without the high and without so much danger to mental health.

the fact is that for many many people this plant works. in other countries its medical extract is available legally (i have a friend in central europe prescribed it for RA). why are we in this country not only not allowed access to this but also discouraged from discussing the denial.
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Re: the magical plant

Postby gillshutt » Wed Mar 24, 2010 10:45 pm

I quite agree Velvet, I'm not stopping the discussion and if the NHS can come up with a form without the mental health side effects I may well push you out the way to get to the front of the queue. :lol:
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Re: the magical plant

Postby smiler22 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:20 am

i agree with you gillshut. firstly i feel that as a moderator you should be able to say what material we discuss on here. an dsecondly i feel that by what you said you was only meaning that becuase this is an open website that anyone including children can read what is discussed on hear. so saying that we should be careful in what form we talk about drugs etc then we have a right to be told by you just to be careful.

as for this weed plant. i would never take it. i dont condone drugs. i do take the rpescibed meds my gp gives me. dont get me wrong but if everthose became illegal i too would stop them even if they had previously been working for me.

illegal is for a reason becasue many people have had bad side effects and maybe death from them. i know that you are going to say that people hav edied form other prescribed drugs also. that is a fair point. but this is my opinion. and im not saying that if you personally want to take weed etc that is upto you.

however over my time as a senior carer i have witnesses patients who hav etaken cannibis and other said drugs for pain. they have found that although it numbs the pain for a few hours if lucky they then have gone down the route that they cant stop taking it, or they have got chest problems, paranoia,ended up with schizephrenia etc etc tec just to name a few. and many of them have said i wish id never taken the stuff?? i even no of people who have lost loved ones to this stuff. and they had been taking it themselves to get over the loss. but then when they stopped an dcame to their senses they felt worse to the point that they wished they had never taken it. as it messed up with their own thoughts an dthey wasnt able to mourn properly their loved one.

many have when gotten dry and free of this drugs have then managed to get pain relieve from natural precription drugs as they have been helped to take them and ha the backup of managing to take them for the desired timeline that these tablets may need to take to work. ie, taking say ami for just one month then getting fedup. in most cases ami may take anywhere between 2-4 months to actually get in to the system and start to benefit.
i know you may say well i get a fix straight away with the weed. but from many i have seen you get that fix but then when it ends you then hav eseveral hours before you take that next oine where you have the very downs. and feel horrible, and sometimes go cold turkey as you neeeeeeed that next one.
so for me id rather take the presciption drugs and give then that chance of working than have the up and down s off the dreaded in betweena dn the horrible feelings of the downs.

again as i said this is only my opinion and i dont stop anyone else from having theres if they want to do this stuff
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Re: the magical plant

Postby siam » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:46 am

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Re: the magical plant

Postby fender1985 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:57 am

i agree with everyone's points. There's so many factors there never could be one definitive answer. I done enough of the stuff to know its down side's, i abused it for year's. For me, i am fine to have it now and then. For the moment anyway. The benefits outweigh the risk. Sorry to hear about the father who passed. I dont need pain med's wen i have had some. I take maybe 15mg of dhc twice in a day, rather than the usual 60mg 4time's a day. Yes we do:) everything on this planet share's a common ancestor. We are related to plants. Animals. Tree's. Bacteria. Virus. Everything alive:) nothing crazy about that, its awesome. Whats crazy is that we evolved from fish lmao :)
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Re: the magical plant

Postby fender1985 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:11 am

smiler, although i agree with most of ur post and see where ur coming from, some of it dont make sense. You mention taking natural prescription drugs. Whether the plant is grown with lights n stuff or not it's more natural than prescription med's. Also we are not talking about heroin or crack here. People can have mental addiction but you do not go cold turkey. I do it once a month if that and thats fine. I used to do it daily and it did affect my mood's, its not like getting a fix like you say. It is no worse drinking once a month. Infact its probably less damaging. Anyway been a long day for me. Time for sleep:)
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Re: the magical plant

Postby Brimstone » Thu Mar 25, 2010 2:59 am

This topic has been one which I have wondered about but reluctant to broach because I thought it would be frowned upon. I find it highly significant that something that influences the subtle balance between conscious and subconscious also brings pain relief.

While one could reason that a side effect of the drug is to lower sensitivity to pain or to block the action of neurotransmitters or whatever, for me this backs up the hypothesis that the subconscious is instigating whatever action that is setting off the pain (rewiring of neurons is still my number one contender) and that by lowering the barrier between the conscious and subconscious, the drug is somehow calming the subconscious’ need to screw up.

A simpler way to look at it is that there is another personality inside our heads that has been set on a self-destructive course, for whatever reason, and by opening a window to the outside world and letting in some fresh air, we are appeasing and distracting her from her screwy behaviour (for men read 'him'). If this sounds a bit spooky, please bear in mind that this is only a representation that helps one to visualise a process and help deal with it. I often use this visualisation when taking on some difficult or distasteful task and enlist his support.

I don’t know what they do in CBT but I would certainly advocate trying to communicate and reason with this other self. Explain to her that she is hurting both of you and try to sooth her anger and reassure her fearfulness. Most of you are animal lovers so approach it as you would try to befriend a stray dog that has been ill-treated and is both nervous and aggressive as a consequence. Like most things it won’t be easy to start with but with practice it will become second nature. It could produce the same effect as the magical plant but without the side effects!
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Re: the magical plant

Postby gillshutt » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:05 am

You can't change your chemical imbalance by talking to your inner self :shock:

For anyone interested this topic has come up before, there is another thread somewhere. I don't mind the discussion but suggesting others try this drug is against the law so you would get banned for that not for discussing the use of it.

I know they have already come up with a drug but it's not prescribed for FM so until it is I'll wait.
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Re: the magical plant

Postby velvet » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:41 am

the other alternative is to move to central europe where it is available on prescription - but then codeine is totally banned (i think its codeine anyway)

it does annoy me that there was (is) a naturally growing plant that because some idiot made a mistake classing it with the opium poppy in law (thats right cannabis was never intended to be made illegal it was a cock up) the authorities had to be seen to uphold the law so they refused to even consider the plants medicinal properties with the result that the only people who would look at the plant were criminals who twisted it for their own purposes with the result that it did become dangerous in the way it was originally not - in the meantime all the law abiding citizens who could have benefited from it are denied it.
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Re: the magical plant

Postby gillshutt » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:55 pm

Since you can now get this for MS on the NHS presumably and hopefully, once they finally take not of the fact that FM is a CNS disorder, we will be able to get it as well. We may have to wait for the US to trial it first :roll: same as everything else :evil:
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Re: the magical plant

Postby hamstergirl » Thu Mar 25, 2010 1:38 pm

Hi

The problem that i have with any drug is the harm that it does to your body. While one, illegal or not drug, is prescribed to help/solve an health issue, long term it can cause different health issues. You then have to stop taking the drug anyway because its having harm on a different area.

At the pain clinic a lady had been taking painkillers for 18 years daily, she is now having major problems with her gastro tract while still having major back pain. My neighbour had to take beta blockers and died of kidney failure. His wife his convinced the drugs given to him caused kidney damage.

So personally the only time i will take a drug if i could be guaranteed to have my life back 90-100%. If that could be done and even if there was side effects that could possibly shorten my life then i would prefer to have 5-10 quality life than a life time of this fm. But there isn't and the drugs given can cause further problems. Its hard enough coping with this with out anything else.

I did occassionally use codiene and paracetamol but since having a tens machine have not used any painkiller for about a month. I also meditate when i'm in agony and it really does help me.

This is a personal view and should my condition change, i will then decide whether to take any medication. However, on saying that my fatigue is far worse than the pain and perhaps a lot of you are in a lot more pain than i am and therefore i may well take whatever is offered.

I've talked a lot to my children about smoking cigarette/drugs (none of which i or my husband has ever tried and don't intend to) about the effects it will have on their body, how addictive it is and the fact you will never have any spare money to buy yourself nice things. I cant stop them, i can only hope they don't want to go down that route and that i've set them an example.

I agree why is it that America always have to trial a drug first!

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Re: the magical plant

Postby smiler22 » Thu Mar 25, 2010 10:59 pm

as i stated i have never taken weed. but the patients i knew who had. said that in between taking the stuff they often felt shaky, withdrawn, trembly and often awful a scan be discribed as some of the affects of cold turkey until they got their next dose which they called their fix.. that is why i said that. some people i know can take this and only take it when necessary and not get addicted to it.

the fact that i said about the presciption drugs is what i meant of the fact that presciption drugs have been tested and tested an dit is well known and is avaiable of what is actually in each drug tablets etc. the word natural i should not of put as that was wrong sentencing of wording. just me getting carried away with tyoing.i know that unnatural things are put in presciption drugs as i have done course s on them as part of my training.

but i still stan dby the fact that if weed is put in tablets that are well know and tested for as part of the tablet substances. such as the one mentioned on here for hopefully ms. it will therefore well covered in the fact that the taking of it will be monitored by the gp, health workers etc. particarly if the follow up is there for the patients. which is not the case for this magic plant. as many people take it but are not monitored with its usage is what i mean. one o fmy fathers medications contains cannibis in very small dosages. but he is well monitored and the tablets have been well tryed and tested.

i know you are not taling about herion etc. that is a hole different ball game.
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Re: the magical plant

Postby Brimstone » Fri Mar 26, 2010 1:55 am

Lorraine, that sounds like a really good attitude and I’m sure your children will benefit from your example.

I agree with your views on taking drugs/painkillers. My dentist always tries to foist a local anaesthetic on me when doing a filling but I always refuse. By concentrating on my big toe when the drill starts up I manage to cope. But I appreciate that there is a huge difference between the odd spot of pain at the dentist’s and the non-stop pain that comes with FM and I make no judgements either way.

It seems logical that keeping in touch with one’s subconscious has benefits and your meditating during the bad times is kind of what I was advocating in my previous post. It is already well-established that mental attitude affects metabolism in all sorts of ways, physiological and chemical. I’m sure that in time drugs will be devised to work further up the cause/effect chain, but it seems likely that the eventual answer to FM will be some kind of therapeutic approach, at least for those cases where the symptoms were initiated by some kind of trauma, maybe just backed up by an hallucinogenic drug.

It’s a huge field and too much to cover in a post but all my postulations are based on research on what is already known. Unfortunately there will always be those who take a closed-minded, ‘if I don’t understand it then it can't be true’ approach. Personally I have always found that thinking outside the box has been a useful asset when meeting challenges.

Maybe you could share more of your own meditation approach with the Forum via a new topic. I’m sure that many on here would find it useful even if others might scoff.
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Re: the magical plant

Postby tireesix » Fri Mar 26, 2010 4:59 am

Totally for cannabis. Despite what people think about it with regards to depression, cannabis was the one thing that got me out of depression, I still have bad days but nothing like pre cannabis. This is REALLY important for me because I do not react at all well with anti depressants, they make me suicidal.

It helps with my pain etc.

As for the side effects of it, if you choose the right stuff, side effects are not too bad and certainly no worse than what you would get from morphine (which I take) tramadol, ibuprofen, paracetamol etc.

As for being confused and forgetful, on new years day this year, thanks to fibro, I almost burnt down my house with all of us in it. No weed in sight, but again, you choose the right weed, and this shouldn't be an issue and if you are smoking enough to make you get all forgetful etc then its probably too much anyway. You don't want a weed that is going to twist your melon, you want one with more body/physical effects rather than brain shrinking effects.

Thing is, I will not drink certain alcohols because of the way they affect me, same goes for cannabis (which I rarely use these days anyway a)cos I cannot get hold of it and b) because I cannot afford it), I will only use a type that suits me, if doesn't suit me, I won't use it. People are idiots, they go out, get cannabis, get stoned but cannabis isn't all about getting stoned, you have to be picky and find the stuff with the right qualities for you. A decent supplier will have a number of different types and will be able to explain the effects of each and will be able to help you pick the right one, but they are hard to find these days.

The other things is, from what I have read, the tablets aren't as good as the real stuff anyway, I believe they are missing something from it. Can't remember was a couple of years ago.

I love Montel, he will tell you all about weed (ya know Montel, the chat show guy from America, ex marine etc). The other thing is, while some idiots do do stupid things after/while smoking, I have personally found that with my old friends, there were way more accidents/deaths etc in the alcohol group than the smoking group. The smoking group was always round each others houses gaming, watching a movie, eating pizza etc, the other lot was driving everywhere or fighting or doing some other absurdly crazy thing.

Personally, I would rather take no drugs at all, but I cannot function without them and if I had it my way, I would much rather be taking cannabis than the prescription drugs I currently take.

Just as an aside, having discussed this many times, as of yet, I haven't had a single doctor knock down cannabis, every single one has always been for it when it has come to depression or chronic pain.

Hell, even my dad smokes pot and you wouldn't think it to look at him, he owns his own companies, very middle class etc etc etc.

I reckon, if it were legalised you would be able to reduce crime, reduce the crap that goes on in order to get it in other countries, you would be able to monitor how it is grown etc. There really aren't any down sides at all that I can think of and all the ones that most people thing of could always be applied to alcohol and thats not illegal.

And if none of this makes sense its because........




Its too early in the morning for me and not because I am stoned.
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